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RedDoggy
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PostSubject: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 5:21 pm

So I'm having a convo with this really nice and pretty woman and she brought something up that I wouldn't have in a million years, but it rang so true for me. Anyway, I wanted to see exactly how right she was.
Who here wonders, in the back of your mind, how your dog would hold up in the box. This isn't a witch hunt, I don't wanna hear who actually has put their dog in the box cause that crap isn't right. I just wanna know how many people have that curiousity, who wonders if their dog is everything an pit bull is supposed to be. I often wonder is my dogs are game or not, do you? It doesn't really matter, I just wonder.
Please don't let this question eat at you later and try to let your dog fight, it's just a question, hehehehehe.

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 5:43 pm

I don't think about it, my dog isn't an APBT grin

And nobody use the winking smiley, LMFAO.

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 5:45 pm

lol Yeah I have Bullies too BUT
Sway would probably get her butt kicked.
Lugz and Piston could definatly hold their own.
And the new pup, well hell thats what he was MADE for!
:)
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 5:47 pm

Right right. You know, dog fights can be entertaining but the fact is that these animals get seriously hurt in the process. Just wanna make it clear that I wouldn't fight my dogs in a million years, I like em to damned much.... But I can't help but wonder.

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 5:51 pm

Rocky would certainly scrap and I can determine from his determination in everything he does that he would not cur right away but I don't think he would last long for the simple fact that he's not as bad ass as he thinks he is..
(Hypothetically speaking)

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Thu 16 Oct 2008, 6:13 pm

I have delt with dog fights that have led me to court and vet bills costing me over a grand I prefer to avoid them at all cost so I don't wonder about them being game I pray I will never see what I have seen again LOL.... but just because a dog is bred off game lines does not make them game or hot I think it just depends on the dog really.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 4:47 am

Well, I know my dogs'll fight, I know they're DA... But how they'd hold up in the box is beyond me. The Peas tore into eachother pretty bad once or twice, once being the time I found out they no longer got along, and another time one of them broke free from her chain, as well as a few smaller fights here and there. They seem to just fight through the pain but I haven't and wouldn't test them to see if they are trully game. I guess that is where I ponder sometimes. Are they game? Well, the world will never know.

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 10:35 am

Well considering how unique the gamness trait is and how few and far between dogs possessing the trait is I say all of them are duds these days..
Unless you are currently testing and have been for the last few generations they are all duds...JMHO

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 4:31 pm

well i know where my dogs rank with each other in my yard from just knowing my dogs but with outsiders thats a whole other story.... i dont play in the illegal feild so i will never know
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 5:02 pm

Admin wrote:
Well considering how unique the gamness trait is and how few and far between dogs possessing the trait is I say all of them are duds these days..
Unless you are currently testing and have been for the last few generations they are all duds...JMHO


I completely agree, and that's where I was going with this thread. I hear lotsa folks talking about game, preserving game and such, and I don't understand why. It's completely irrelevent with these dogs these days. I know there are illegal sites where you can find pups off of some mean ass dogs, but who the heck, other than a dog fighter, wants one of these? Game dogs just are common anymore. You don't have em' in your yard, you don't see them walking down the street, you don't even see them being taken out of Micheal Vicks yard. It's a reality that I'm on the fence about, but game is as dead as disco.

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 5:24 pm

Agreed I don't care if you just bought a dog off floyd himself if the dog is not tested and matched with titles it means nothing other than the dog comes from a history of game lines. People seem to be under the impression if they buy game bred dogs that means they are getting game dogs LOL .. I don't know how they could think that because gameness is very rare and unique in it's own form and our breed today because it's not legal to fight and test anymore. So it's pretty much all irrelavent I have dogs from game lines I don't see the big deal other than they may be more prey driven and DA but's that's about it.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 5:32 pm

i've had some yard accidents and i wouldnt want to se my dogs in a pit knowing i was the ones that put them there as far as being duds dont know where you are and what blood lines you got but game cant be breed out of the dog as long as you keep the line tight and know what to look for and ask the big guys when you meet them about there dogs and why they picked them and reed the old mags about it pick up THE PITBULL BIBLE then you will have REAL APBT not your so called duds but true you will never know what the dog will do in the pit unless you put it in there but as you have dogs on a yard you see the actions of a da dog and a none da dog and if a dog turns on or not but who am i to say ive never fought dogs or never will and would never go watch or sell to a fighting yard but your not buying a game dog your buying a GAME BREED DOG the game breed dog is what the breed is suppose to be not these bully things you see that are nothing but mutts
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Fri 17 Oct 2008, 9:35 pm

GAME BRED DOES NOT EQUAL = GAME DOG ... those are 2 different things in order for your dog to be considered GAME the dog would have to be put in a ring and challanged and continue to fight until either his/her opponet gives up or until the dog dies fighting this is what GAME IS .. Yard fights mean nothing they are yard fights they happen with any breed of dog not just apbts and they don't measure a dogs gameness . Gameness is something none of us here will ever understand beyond it's definition ... unless we are in the box with the dog for the fight we can only imagine how our dogs would hold up in the box because none of us have been there to see gameness in it's purest form. Also dog aggression does not equal game dog. Dog aggression is common with the american pitbull terrier and should not be confused with GAME DOG. People can think their dogs are game all they want because they are bred from game lines or because they are severely DA but those things mean nothing in the real world of dogfighting because it's been said by many of the greatest dog fighter's a true GAME dog with the true posession of GAMENESS is very very hard to come by.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sat 18 Oct 2008, 6:31 pm

I don't wonder about how "game" my dogs are. I'm too busy finding ways to keep them apart.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sat 18 Oct 2008, 9:11 pm

I don't much care myself, gameness don't have much valor these days IMHO.
Now if someone was to prove to me that a game or even gamebred pit makes a better working dog and I was into pulling or something then I'll eat my shirt.. coffee

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sat 18 Oct 2008, 9:23 pm

Game - Courageous, dexterous, obstinate, spontaneous; bravery and heroism from a noble and self sacrificing devotion; a contest lasting until a result is obtained


Gamedog - A proven game, deep game or dead game fighting dog


Gameness - A very hard to obtain, courageous, dexterous, obstinate, spontaneous grade of game. Once obtained it is very hard to hold onto. Once lost it is impossible to obtain again, except through sheer luck occasionally or many years of breeding, conditioning, and culling

Game Test - To test the degree of gameness by consecutively rolling and scratching a dog after tiring, to a fresh dog

this is from game dog .com My dogs are from GAMEBREEDLINES thats what i tell people not that i raise game dogs unless im talking to a bunch of pit people like on here and i say game dog to keep me frome typing it over and over is that better for ya
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 12:55 am

What I find to be kinda funny about this topic is that the people who say that there is no place for gameness in these dogs any more also send me links to match clips, links to kennels breeding game dogs, links to vids about well known dogmen of today. See the confusion here? The sport is still alive folks. Just cause you can't be a part of it due to the laws here in the USA does not mean that it's a thing of the past. See? It's just a little bit selfish of us to say "well, we can't do it, so it doesn't matter any more." It's still the most basic fundamental of the breed. We don't have to set our dogs down to prove anything about them, but we also should not be out there breeding pups with no regard to gameness either. Something worth doing is worth doing right, right? If you can't appreciate the definition, well then, find another word.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 3:48 am

buzhunter wrote:
What I find to be kinda funny about this topic is that the people who say that there is no place for gameness in these dogs any more also send me links to match clips, links to kennels breeding game dogs, links to vids about well known dogmen of today. See the confusion here? The sport is still alive folks. Just cause you can't be a part of it due to the laws here in the USA does not mean that it's a thing of the past. See? It's just a little bit selfish of us to say "well, we can't do it, so it doesn't matter any more." It's still the most basic fundamental of the breed. We don't have to set our dogs down to prove anything about them, but we also should not be out there breeding pups with no regard to gameness either. Something worth doing is worth doing right, right? If you can't appreciate the definition, well then, find another word.

The sport is alive to those who choose to break the laws or fight their dogs in other parts of the world where dogfighting is still legal. But on these forums everything is hypothetical because I am assuming most of us are not involved in the sport per say therefore we can only comment on gameness as it relates to definition. Because NONE of us at least to my knowledge fight their dogs or are involved deep in the sport therefore it's pretty useless for us to debate gameness as it relates to our dogs because unless we are fighting them or breeding them for gameness what the hell is the purpose of gameness in pet's or show dogs which is what most of us here own ??? I will even go so far as to say we wouldn't know gameness if it hit us in the ass. Unless your a professional dogger who has been exposed to the game you really have no use for gameness and true gamedogs JMO most people wouldn't know how to handle these types of dogs anyway . And when I say game dogs I mean dogs who have been fought or are being fought presently not your typical game bred dogs who have been bred off game lines.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 5:08 am

So, what exactly are you trying to tell me here? If it's against the law, happening outside the United States, or someow out of sync with the mainstream, 21st century pet bull society then it's just irrelevant? This is not a hyothetical discussion. It's a discussion of a very real trait in only the most honest of dogs. No disclaimer necessary. lmfao
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 5:42 am

What I am saying is none of us here unless heavily involved in dofighting and the breeding of gamedogs for the original purpose in which they were orginally bred for ( the box) will ever see gameness in their dogs in it's purest orginal form the way it was originally intended to be seen and carried out with this breed. Other than that it's pitbull history or education on the breed that can ONLY be discussed hypothetically because unless you have witnessed it what more could you possibly say about the topic? How can you truely discuss something you have no real understanding of or have never seen with your own eyes ? Without using assumptions or here-say? You can't!!! and your right gameness is a real trait ... so real and so rare that it will not be seen in any of our dogs breeding for gameness should be left to the dogger's who breed for a specific purpose the box that is what gameness in this breed was intended for. Leave gamedogs and gameness to the professioanl doggers who breed with the orginal intended purpose in mind other than that I see no need for an average joe or breeder to be running around trying to breed for gameness when they can't even understand themselves. JMO
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 8:03 am

Well I guess the thread had started out as a hypothetical discussion but, as they always do, the debate has taken a turn in a new direction. I understand what you are saying. But it's a good opportunity to shed a little light on the subject. Who knows, maybe someone reading through this can come away with a fresh point of view and a little more knowledge. As far as the original question goes... All I know is blue dogs from GA don't stand a chance! haha
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 11:56 am

thumbsup
buzhunter wrote:
What I find to be kinda funny about this topic is that the people who say that there is no place for gameness in these dogs any more also send me links to match clips, links to kennels breeding game dogs, links to vids about well known dogmen of today. See the confusion here? The sport is still alive folks. Just cause you can't be a part of it due to the laws here in the USA does not mean that it's a thing of the past. See? It's just a little bit selfish of us to say "well, we can't do it, so it doesn't matter any more." It's still the most basic fundamental of the breed. We don't have to set our dogs down to prove anything about them, but we also should not be out there breeding pups with no regard to gameness either. Something worth doing is worth doing right, right? If you can't appreciate the definition, well then, find another word.



groovy goodpost thumbu rofl thanks for that bravo said it better than i could have
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 1:25 pm

Like I said before, Show me how gameness will benefit you legally and I'll eat my shirt..

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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 3:35 pm

It gets u ribbons in the ring...Did you forget that...Which I can't figure out since they are not fighting in the ring.I been reading and in chats a few times and hear my dogs so game we had to turn around and we get points for that.WELL if your dog game was that deep you would have a dead dog somewhere.....Its more like my dog so DA that we got turned around.
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PostSubject: Re: Gameness   Sun 19 Oct 2008, 3:46 pm

buzhunter wrote:
Well I guess the thread had started out as a hypothetical discussion but, as they always do, the debate has taken a turn in a new direction. I understand what you are saying. But it's a good opportunity to shed a little light on the subject. Who knows, maybe someone reading through this can come away with a fresh point of view and a little more knowledge. As far as the original question goes... All I know is blue dogs from GA don't stand a chance! haha


Well to be honest half the game bred dogs today blue red orange ect don't stand a chance no matter where they are that's just reality thumbsup Anyway I am done imagining I will never know and it does not matter to me personally. Historically it's great to have a understanding about gameness but that's as far as it goes here I'm no dogger and don't pretend to be nor am I a fool who walks around with gamebred dogs thinking that means I have game dogs or dogs who possess gameness I know the difference by way of definition you also have alot of those wanna be dogger's/game bred breeder's who talk big shit about something they have never seen and than you have those who don't talk about it because they are not stupid enough to hang themselves real dogfighter's do what they do and only those involved know about it.


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